Weaponbalance

[Abyx]

blue said:

Anyway, where was I ? Right, the crossbow being able to kill stuff with a headshot. See, the thing about headshots right now is that you can pop the head off of a Clot with one single shot out of the 9mm and he doesn´t die. Same for bloats. Why should they die then when their head is blown off by a high-powered crossbow bolt ?

Because 9mm bullets are smaller.

Think about it, imagine getting shot in the forehead with a 9mm bullet. You get a small entry wound and a medium size exit wound if the bullet goes through.

Now imagine a high powered crossbow bolt(Which usually aren't sharp, from what I know about them.), being flung with maybe over 300lbs(Just an example, I know that's alot) of drawing power. That's like dropping a heavy person on your face, but with the size of a crossbow bolt.

[Blue]

Sure, but the head is severed anyway.

[Abyx]

Well..uh..my point is..it hurts more?

[Blue]

Well ingame you get your head blown off by a single bullet out of the 9mm pistol. Head off. Zombie is headless. Normally you would have a little hole in your head. "Normally" a zombie would continue to go on with a hole in it´s head. Here the zombie goes on without his head.

Now if you hit him with a crossbow and his head gets flunked across the street the head is off, too. The Zombie is headless. Maybe a chunk out of his neck is missing as well. Why doesn´t it go on ?

To make it short: I vote for making the 9mm need more shots on a specimens head to blow it off if you are going to give the crossbow a headshot multiplier this high.

[faust]

I vote for balance > logic

[tabcef]

While it seems like the only way to balance out the Crossbow and Winchester, I don't like the idea of having the zoom be stronger...

The main reason is because I -never-, -ever-, use the zooms on those things, and can score headshots nigh nonstop on everything..

Thing is with the scoped in doing more damage, people will probably just scope in, shoot, scope out to move..
If you ever played AVP2, think of 'double tapping' for the sniper rifle... Basically rapid firing it by moving in and out of the scope while shooting..

[zombieButcher]

faust said:

I vote for balance > logic

Agreed.

[Dastard]

What I would like to see is maybe a damaged head model being used instead of just plain completely off, then we wouldn't have any people moaning that it makes no sense that a 9mm headshot does less damage than a crossbow bolt.

I've been thinking that the melee weapons need some sort of horizontal attack. Not necessarily the knife, but the pipe and the axe. Maybe do 3/4ths the damage, but effect all zeds in a horizontal arc? I dunno, just something to give the melee weapons more utility and thus more capability in game.

[uwasawaya]

Yep, the pipe and axe are crazy underpowered as it is, seeing as how a single human can kill 60 monsters with a piece of lead... they need to have long range, to fight off bloats and Sirens... and maybe stun Fleshpounds, since it's not fair that they are hard to kill. They could shoot lightning too.

I think we actually need more weapons, just a way of ramping up the arsenal, as I had suggested. The bullpup, as it is, is pointless. 20 rounds to kill a clot with 5.56 ammo is beyond me. The ammo doesn't last long enough, and the dualies are still more effective. I propose upping the damage of the bullpup, maybe to that of the pistol per bullet, and making it 300... as an alternative to the shotgun, not something to just 'get stuck with'.

Personally, the bullpup is the biggest problem for me... we lost the accuracy from the 1.0 due to the scope, it still doesn't kill what it needs to kill, and the ammo, even with 10 clips, is gone in 10 minutes. I've never seen anyone buy the weapon, mostly because everyone starts with enough for the shotgun.

[Abyx]

Yes, the bullpup is extremely underpowered. Since I'd imagine they'd be using JHP 5.56 bullets, that's like getting a rock about XXXXX big thrown at you at high speeds and having it flatten against you.

Instead the bullpup shoots peas.

[tabcef]

I dunno, the bullpup seems like the most useful weapon to me, IMO..

It's literally the 'bread and butter' weapon..

But hey, making it more powerful would just mean more fun for me.

[uwasawaya]

Tab... have you played it? The damn thing won't get you past the third wave. I mean, I'm sure it has its uses... such as instead of the knife... but still... A shotgun can kill 8 clots in a clip... the bullpup, maybe two.

[tronicmind]

hi again

my balancepost was before playing the 2.0.1 patch.

here is what i think now:

winchesster is perfect. headshot kill clots instanly, stalker with one shot, bloat with headshot two rounds. its cool.

the crossbow is very heavy now if you have the right circumstances. a long narrow corridor to line up the zombies. if these settings are set to true you can do massive damage.

well , i like to try a little different approach to balancing:
let the weapons right the way they are now, including the x-bow
but try to tweak their "weight" in the game over ammo ammount and cost.

by rising the costs for crossbow arrows and reducing the amount you can have the player cant use it to wipe out a whole wave alone. he has to think about when he is using this mihgty device.

in doom 1 for example you can fire the BFG with full mags including backpack 7 times. the weapon is overpowered but doesnt ruin the gamebalance this way.

why not reducing the damage?
because it feeeels so good to mow down the mob with razorsharp arrows. everytime a good situation comes up i enjoy it very much. but you have to fight for this feeling of might.

maybe rise the weight of the crossbow so you can only have a 9mm and the kinfe with you. this way you a the spezialist. you wont shoot a single stalker or clot. this is what your teammates are for. you are the safety when the hunting shottys run out of ammo or the pressure gets to high. you are in the second row with your 15 bolts. but when your time has come you rock

[Seras Victoria]

You forget the thing about teammates jumping in front of you, it's hard to keep your credits high enough to even autoammo for me with 3+ players jumping in front of me with hunting shotties. It is even harder to heal them though as they keep making stupid movements even when it is NOT needed and when you miss it takes annother 10 seconds before you can use the shot again...

[uwasawaya]

It's true... gotta factor in the enthusiasm with which folks jump in front of you... lol

And the Xbow ammo is pretty darn expensive as it is...